Will Nest mesh WIFI solve my router issue?

[Andywrl]

My question does not relate to a Google WIFI I currently have, it is asking if getting Google WIFI will help me resolve my issue - I am not techie enough to work this out I just have a theory - I need advice from someone that understands how Routers/WIFI work?

My router drops connections to devices and it seems to do it in a cycle. If the front room TV is working at some point it will lose connection and after about 20 seconds will reconnect to WIFI, at a different time the back room tv, laptop and my phone will do the same. As this happens in cycles of losing and rejoining the WIFI at different times I know the router is not restarting as they do not lose connection at the same time.

Initially I thought this was a problem with the TalkTalk router so I got them to replace it with a new one but this one does the same, the only way i seem to be able to prevent this happening all the time is to switch off the router for 20 minutes every day which I do, this seems to last for about 36hours then it will start doing it again.

In my head I am thinking it is because of the number of devices connected and it drops one to connect another and so on but when I read the specs of the router and it states it can handle around 250 connected items and I have nowhere near that many, i have about 45ish, not all devices but connections shown.

I recently read somewhere though that no matter what the router specs says a router cannot handle any more than around 32 connections per channel before there will be issues.

so my questions are....

1) Am I right in thinking this may be the problem with my devices dropping in what appears to be a cycle?

2) Is it right that the router although it says can handle over 200 connections may be struggling with my 45?

3) I have read the Google Mesh WIFI literature and am I right in thinking that if I bought one of these it will be just 1 connection to my existing router and all other connections will be to the Google network therefore will not be overloading the connections to the existing Talk Talk router? - I.E, Talk Talk will see one connection but I will have 40 devices attached to Google WIFI for example?

4) I suppose the next question is can the Google WIFI handle that many connections and I will just not be transferring the issue to Google WIFI?

Many thanks for your help if anyone can answer these questions

[MichaelP]

Hello @Andywrl 

Can I start by asking how well ventilated your existing TalkTalk router is? Also, Is your existing router placed relatively close to the center of your home, up high above as much furniture and appliances as possible? Do you have any other wireless equipment in use (cordless phones, baby monitors, etc., but especially watch out for wireless surround sound systems, or just a wireless subwoofer or maybe a wireless gaming headset)?

This doesn't "feel" like a "too many devices" problem to me, especially since it's really unlikely they are all really active at the same time. It is possible this is just "crappy router design", though, which would explain why the replacement isn't any better. Still, the behavior is odd.

To attempt to answer your questions as best I can:

1. Maybe? Like I said, it's really hard to know exactly why this is happening. It could just be the devices are struggling with very poor signal quality themselves (and, sadly, a lot of devices have very poor WiFi implementations themselves).
2. The 200 connections number is likely related to how many IP addresses it is configured to hand out by default. I suppose it's possible that if you have a bunch of devices that are changing their MAC addresses periodically (and getting a new IP address every time as a result), they could be draining your IP address pool. This feels unlikely, though.
3. Yes, a system like Google WiFi (or really any off-the-shelf home WiFi router) will look like one wired client to your existing TalkTalk router, and it will then handle all of the clients (including wired clients connected through the Google WiFi router's LAN Ethernet port). My Google WiFi system certainly doesn't struggle with a similar number of total clients, though I also put in the effort to wire up my most traffic-intensive devices.
4. This really depends on what the source of your current issue is. If it's "crappy router design", then a "better" router could easily resolve the issue. But, if it's signal quality, then it's possible a replacement will suffer from the same issue, depending on how it's placed, how far away the clients are, what the walls are constructed from, whether there are other wireless devices interfering, and even how well-ventilated the equipment is.

Basically, diagnosing issues like this can be extremely difficult (especially remotely). If any of the above questions help shed light on what might be going wrong, I would encourage you to address those potential issues (e.g., placement, ventilation, interference, etc.) before spending any money. But, if none of those are likely causes, then you could try setting up another WiFi router to see if it helps. That's a fair amount of work, but having a system that doesn't work is just daily frustration. I would keep the original packaging and the receipt, though, in case you need to return it.

[Andywrl]

Hi Michael,

Than you very much for your speedy reply and very detailed response, you clearly know your stuff and have put forward some very good suggestions which I can play around with as possible solutions.

I am tempted to just go with the suggestion that the router is just a crappy design as a lot of the other things you mentioned i have over the past few months looked at. 

The router is well ventilated on top of a unit in the hallway which is pretty central to the house, There is nothing else obstructing the router and I have checked the quality of the Wifi signal on the devices that I can such as the 3 smart TV's, all show a medium to strong signal so I don't think that is the problem for these items at least but may be for the furthest switches.

I have solid brick walls throughout the home so signal strength was a thought I did have but even the closest items fail in rotation so I don't think signal is a problem for them.

As you know a lot about the subject maybe if I tell you what I have connected that may help?

I have 3 TV's, 19 smart switches, 8 Google Mini smart speakers and a wireless alarm system with it's own router hard wired to the router.

Along with this I would have at any point a laptop and a mobile phone connected and that is it.

I do not have any wireless sound system, but i do have a cordless phone and the base unit is close to the router as that is where the main telephone socket is - could that be causing the issue?

Something I have noticed is that when one Sonoff smart switch loses connection all of them (13) lose the connection together in the ewelink app, this is different to other items that lose connection as they tend to drop one at a time such as Tv in lounge comes back on and then the back room TV loses connection. My other smart switches however of a different make never lose connection all together only when I lose wifi for all items at the same time.

Thank you for your help, it's much appreciated and good to have some suggestions to try.

Andy

[MichaelP]

Hello @Andywrl 

Brick walls are a bit of a red flag, actually – that will make WiFi challenging in general, and more challenging for 5GHz in particular (which is the band Google / Nest WiFi units use to talk to each other).

Just double-checking that the "unit" the WiFi router is currently on top of isn't made from metal?

Any idea what wireless technology the alarm system uses? It probably isn't causing interference, but it's a possibility I would investigate.

I would definitely try to move the cordless phone base unit away from the router, even if it isn't in exactly the same band. My DECT cordless phone system uses 4.9GHz, and I have it 6 feet from the nearest Google WiFi unit, and I don't have issues. I'd be worried about having it much closer than that.

The Sonoff behavior is strange, I agree. I don't have experience with that equipment, so I can't speculate on why that might be.

[Andywrl]

Thank you Michael, the unit is made of wood not metal but I will investigate the alarm and move the cordless phone further away and see if that may be the cause, your help and suggestions have been much appreciated. 

Andy

[Jeff]

Hi, Andywrl.

I just wanted to check in real fast to see if we were able to resolve this or if there's anything else you needed from us. If there's anything else I can provide, please let me know.

Thanks.

[Andywrl]

It's a bit early to say if my issue with my current router is fixed using the suggestions I received but I think I will give a Nest WIFI a go anyway in the near future regardless so thank you, issue may be resolved, only time will tell but I have learnt more about Nest WIFI so that was a bonus.

[GarrettDS]

Hey folks, 

It looks like we have come to a solution so I'm going to be locking this thread. If you have any other concerns or questions, please feel free to create a new thread. 

Have a great day. 

Garrett DS