Setup my ISP Fios router+ 2 google nest routers+ 2 google wifi point with same SSID

[SammyUS]

Hi all,

I have tried researching on this & tried most of the recommendations but didn’t work. So here I’m starting all over from basic.. 

I have FIOS internet with fios router + switch provided by ISP with multiple ports + 2 google routers + 2 google wifi points. my home is 3900sqft with 3 floors(basement, 1st and 2nd). Each floor have the ethernet cables running from basement’s server room. I intend to connect 2 google routers(1 in 1st floor & other in 2nd floor) & 2 wifi access points (1 in each floor) in addition to my existing fios router provided by isp. That said I want to use same wifi name(MYHome)  so that a seamless switch happens when I use my phone/laptop and move from one floor to another with out manually changing networks.

I have found the ethernet cables that run to each floor and connected it to the switch in server room(basement). That switch is connected to 10GE LAN port of fios router. Now I tried to setup my google router 1 from 2nd floor by connecting it to the ethernet cable that is passed to 2nd floor(At this point, I’m not sure if it internet is connected through the ethernet cable or did it take my existing wifi connection). Then I started setting up the 2nd google router in 1st floor by connecting the ethernet cable. It automatically treated as bridge mode(not sure if it is connected through wifi or through ethernet cable). Then I tried to setup the google AP1 in 1st floor which completes all steps except it fails at past step “waiting for final bits of setup to complete” and timed out. Couldn’t get past this last step & tried all recommended steps regarding this error that i found online. Did several factory resets, changed locations etc etc.

Of all the steps I followed, I’m still unsure if the google router used my ethernet port to connect to network or did it use the wifi.

So can some one walk me through the detailed step by step process with the kind of setup that I’m looking for? I’m really exhausted at this point spending countless number of hrs setting up & researching. Really appreciate you guys if some one could save me from this trouble..

[thisisausername]

You have a minimum of 3 routers, and a possible of 5. I'd need EVERY detail model, etc, which you likely won't type. From your description, it sounds like you have multiple DHCP servers. Just get the mesh solutions and enjoy slow wifi.

If you insist on slogging through it, get them model numbers or learn what router BSS, ESS etc are.

[SammyUS]

Thanks for willing to help!

Fios router model# CR1000A

google router 1 & 2 model number: H2D

Google wifi AP 1&2 came along with above routers.

Let me know if you need any other details.

[SammyUS]

Desperately looking for help as I work remote and constantly on wifi.

[SammyUS]

@PatrickP_Viking - can you please help me. I'm currently stranded with unstable connection. Really appreciate your help!

[PatrickP_Viking]

Hey @SammyUS .

I would be glad to help; thanks for reaching out. Setting up a multi-floor network can be daunting, especially with Verizon Fios involved since they don't make it easy to do, and can take some networking experience to get right. Since there are a lot of points here it will be a bit lengthy of a response to cover everything in detail but I think we can get this resolved.

I'll reply in the next post (lengthy for detail) with the info.

[SammyUS]

I really appreciate your lending hand here. That gives me hope that things can work as expected. Thank you🙂

[PatrickP_Viking]

Hey @SammyUS .

Please see the below details that should get everything resolved. Please reach back out if you have any questions, concerns, and/or to let me know if you were able to get things resolved.

Unpacking the setup failures:

• The Fios router is still in play - The Fios router is supplying the routing and Wifi by default. It has to be removed from the equation or you will have Double NAT issues. Only one device can provide the routing itself in short. We'll go over how to eliminate the Fios router later.
• Trying to add 2 additional Google/Nest Wifi routers and additional points to the network - You should only use one router to manage the traffic to prevent Double NAT. Also, Google/Nest Wifi devices are designed to automatically go into bridge mode if another router is detected managing traffic which is why that happened; this is to prevent issues with routing. Because the Google/Nest router is going into bridge mode, you cannot connect additional points to it.
• Setting up multiple networks with same SSID & password - This will cause constant connections and disconnects as the devices search making the connections unstable. Depending on which network point has the best connection will determine which one the device connects to. Since the device connecting constantly scans for better connections in most cases, just moving around a room could result in switching. You should use only 1 SSID and password established in a single network with hardwired points to extend it.
• iOS causes known issues - Due to default settings in iOS, Apple device settings have to be modified. All of the changes will be outlined in the solution.

Network setup recommendations. Please follow the steps outlined in order:

1. In general, this article will assist with basic hardwired setups for future reference: Hardwire Wifi devices with Ethernet 
• For visibility, the setup we'll use is ONT > Google/Nest router > Switch > Points and/or MoCA
2. Address the iOS caused issues - Please reference this article to turn off known iOS settings so they will not interfere later during setup: Troubleshoot setup with iOS 
3. Delete any current network from the Google Home app. This should factory reset any connected Google/Nest Wifi devices but I'd perfom a manual reset on them to make sure they are as noted in #4.
4. Reset the Google/Nest Wifi devices: Factory reset your Wifi device 
5. Remove the Fios router from the equation. The Fios router is only performing the routing and converting the signal for use with phone and TV, if you have the other services. It can be eliminated completely despite what they tell you.
   • Use this article if you have internet ONLY: Use Own Router with FiOS ONT Ethernet 
   • Use this article if you have internet AND phone or TV service via Fios: How to Use Your Own Router With Verizon FiOS 
     • NOTE: If you have TV service with Fios, you will need to purchase a MoCA device(s) to convert the signal for TV use. The Fios router has one of these built into it (typical) and sometimes is integrated in the ONT (rarely though). Any MoCA devices needed will be covered further down so wait on purchasing one or setting them up until then.
6. Setup the main Google/Nest Wifi device - Follow the appropriate link in the following article for the device you have. Make sure the iOS settings have been addressed as noted above. Get started 
   • NOTE: you will ONLY be setting up the main router right now.
7. Connect the Switch - Connect an Ethernet cable from the Google/Nest router open port to the input (or port #1 depending on Switch) port on the Switch.
   • Connect a laptop to the Switch via Ethernet to see if you have connection to the internet. If not, restart the Google/Nest router and switch and try again after they both fully reboot.
   • If you do, have connection established, move to #8.
8. Set up Mesh by connecting points to Switch - These need to be done one at a time to full setup before moving to the next point you want to connect. Connect an Ethernet cable from the first available open port on the Switch to the device on the next floor you want to cover. Connect the other end to the point you want to set up WITH THE POWER CABLE REMOVED. Then power up the point, wait for it to fully boot, and add it to the network via the Google Home app.
   • To connect additional points, follow the above procedure for each additional point making sure they are powered off before connecting the Ethernet cable. This will ensure that a wired connection is established in the Mesh instead of a wireless one.
9. Add MoCA device(s) (if needed) - See the below NOTE first. If you need a MoCA device(s) for TV service with Fios, you can find them  by searching Amazon . DO NOT get the cheapest one as they can cause issues; a mid-range one is a good option at the minimum. You will connect them from an open pot on the Switch or point )depending on the point you have).
   • NOTE: Check the TV service before adding a MoCA. Some newer ONTs will convert the signal and nothing has to be added but this is rare but can save money if it isn't needed.
10. Check the network via the Google Home app - Run a Speed Test and Mesh Test via the Home app. This will verify the network is up and running correctly.
    • If there are issues or errors, power off (no reboot) all of the devices one at a time starting from the furthest device out and working your way back to the ONT. Connect the power back to the ONT and then to each of the other devices one at a time starting with the Google/Nest router and working further out. Retest once all devices are fully powered back up.
    • Once the network is verified as working, make sure other devices can connect to the network.
11. If you are still having issues, please advise with the step the issue occurred on and if the previous steps were completed without errors/problems. We'll take a look if issues still persist to get things back on track.

This configuration will establish a home network with a single router and multiple points connected via hardwire for maximum coverage and should resolve the multi-floor setup issues. If you need to make more connections from the Switch than what you have available ports for, let me know and I can help you expand the setup further. I actually have two Switches in my own network covering two floors and handling 40-50 connections at any one time. I've used the same setup with pre-Google Wifi devices, with the OnHub, again with Google Wifi (Gen 1), and with my current setup with the new Nest Wifi Pro.

Please let me know how things go, good or bad.  

[LovelyM]

Hello everyone, 

@thisisausername and @PatrickP_Viking, I'm grateful for the information that you've shared.

@SammyUS, I'm checking in to see if you still need help. Please tell me if you have additional questions or concerns. I want to make sure you're all good now.

Best, 
Lovely

[SammyUS]

Thanks Patrivk! I have 2 nest routers + 2 nest points. Based on what you’re saying, I need to connect the router 1 in basement 1st by eliminating fios router then connect the other Lan port to the switch.
Connect the ethernet cables (that goes to each floor from basement) to the remaining  ports on the switch.

connect my router 2 to floor 1 ethernet point.

- till this part, router 1 and router 2 formed a mesh which is WIRED.

if all the above is correct, then here’s the followup question:-

1. do i need to purchase router3 and connect it at floor 2?

2. How do i use my remaining 2 google nest points(that doesn’t have a any lan or wan slots other than power slot?

[SammyUS]

 @PatrickP_Viking - please share your expertise about my above queries so that I can setup myhome wifi over this weekend! Thank you & really appreciate it!

[PatrickP_Viking]

Hey @SammyUS .

I've been dealing with a autoimmune disease flare up tonight. I'll put something together in the morning that should get you up and running.

[PatrickP_Viking]

Hey @SammyUS .

Thanks for your patience.

You will need to remove the Verizon Fios router completely from the equation as I noted in the previous detailed post on how to replace your Fios router. Once you have configured the settings as described and removed the Verizon router, just follow the normal setup process for the Nest Wifi. NOTE: you will still need to make sure the iOS issues are addressed as described in the previously noted reply.

Now, since you are using 2 Nest Wifi routers and two points and the points do not have Ethernet ports, I'd recommend the following setup.

• ONT
• First Nest Wifi router
• Place the first point on floor 1; this will be a wireless mesh connection
• Connect an Ethernet cable from the Router 1 LAN port to the second Nest Wifi router and place this router on floor 2; this will be a wired mesh connection
• Place the second point on the floor that needs additional coverage or where it will cover the most area; this will also be a Wifi connection

If you cannot place the second Nest Wifi router on floor two with Ethernet, place it on floor 1 and the first point on floor 2, then add the second point where it is needed for coverage. Both the second router and the points will be Wifi mesh connections in this setup but should help.

If you have issues with everything connecting (or even to test), remove the power cable from all devices starting with the furthest out and work you way back to the ONT. Power them back up one at a time starting with the ONT and working your way back to the furthest out. Once all are back online, test the network.

Let me know if this gets things working.

[SammyUS]

@PatrickP_Viking - Sorry to hear that you’re not feeling well. Hope you recover soon & thank you for your commitment to share your knowledge here.

Gotcha! How does this sound?

1. Router 1 in basement connected with ONT and it lan is connected to switch.

2. Switch is connected to ethernet cables that go to floor 1 and floor 2.

3. Router 2 is connected to ethernet in floor 1, whose other end  is already connected to switch in basement forming a wired mesh with router 1.

4. At this point i’m planning  on getting nest ROUTER 3, which will be added/connected in floor 2’s ethernet cable whose other end  is already connected to switch in basement forming a mesh wired with router 1 & making the mesh to have router 1, router2(bridge to floor 1), router3(bridge to floor 2)

5. So now i have all 3 floors covered with router 1, 2, 3 with wired overhaul & SSID will be same all across with little loss of speed when compared to wireless point setup.

6. Now, I’m left with my 2 nest points with no ports except for power. I will plan to add them adhoc if I still notice any dead zones in my home.

The question at this point is,

1). will I be able to connect my nest wifi point wireless in either floor 1 or floor 2 to my existing mesh setup that already have 3 routers(while i believe 1 will be parent that is in basement & rest 2 will be bridge mode at floor 1 & 2 wired connection)

2). In the above case, if i try to setup my wireless point in floor 2 - will it be connecting to the closest router/bridge which is router 2 in floor 2 or will it be connecting to parent router in basement(which might beat the purpose of introducing a wireless point).

Let me know, if what I’m thinking to do makes any sense to get max wifi coverage with less to No connection drops. Thank you!

[PatrickP_Viking]

Hey @SammyUS .

If you plan on buying a third router and add a switch, I'd recommend that setup over the others so the main points will be connected in a wired mesh. I've personally used two switches with the Google Wifi (Gen 1) and now with the Nest Wifi Pro. The advantage of adding a switch(es) is that you can also connect other devices directly to the switch or one of the open LAN ports which will increase their performance as well compared to a wireless connection.

As far as connecting the wireless points, any point will pair with the main router in the basement. 

Let me know if this gets everything back up and running.

[SammyUS]

@PatrickP_Viking That makes sense. As my primary concern is to set the mesh up & running - Basically for now I’m only using ONE switch in the basement whose port 1 is connected to main parent router & the rest of routers are connected to port 2, port 3 using an ethernet passing to each floor. Cool?

[PatrickP_Viking]

That will work. Just make sure it is an unmanaged switch if you haven't already.

[SammyUS]

@PatrickP_Viking I have D-Link DGS-1005G with 5 to 6 ports that was provided by the ISP. How to find if it is a managed or unmanaged?

[PatrickP_Viking]

Hey @SammyUS .

According to the search I did, it is an unmanaged switch.

[SammyUS]

@PatrickP_Viking - sorry for too many questions & thank you for patiently answering it for me. Hope this is the last quest before i begin the setup.

As I have few smart devices at home that use 2GHz & few other devices like work laptop that needs 5GHz, will this setup auto support this based on the device? or do I need to manually change in setup?

2.While setting up connecting my router 2 to ethernet, how do i confirm if it is connected wirelessly or wired to form a mesh as the only thing it shows is connected as bridge but doesnt show if it is connected wireless or wired though it is hard wired?

3. As me & my wife’s work station is in floor 2 where router 2 is located 3 rooms apart, will it connect to router 2 or router 3? If it is based on strongest signal, will it have a proper seamless transition from router 2 to router 3 without drop off my zoom call/teams or show any connectivity disruption popups?

[PatrickP_Viking]

No problem, @SammyUS .

This article should cover all of your questions. In short, the device connecting decides the type of connection to make and what device to connect to. This can be influenced by interference, range, etc.

How Nest Wifi and Google Wifi 2.4, 5 GHz, and 6 GHz bands work 

[SammyUS]

@PatrickP_Viking Also, do I need to buy a modem? As currently fios only gave me router & not sure if it has inbuild modem or does ONT enables us to connect directly to router?

[PatrickP_Viking]

@SammyUS , you just need the ONT. Once the configuration is done in the first part of the instructions, the ONT will send the fiber signal over Ethernet to the Nest Wifi router. 

[AbigailF]

Hey folks, 

Thanks for lending a hand, @PatrickP_Viking.
@SammyUS, I wanted to follow up and see if you are still in need of any help. Please let me know if you are still having any concerns or questions from here, as I would be happy to take a closer look and assist you further.

Thanks,
Abi

[SammyUS]

@PatrickP_Viking Thank you so much for your help! Was able to setup the wired mesh with 4 wifi routers(ONT to 1 main google router to switch to 3 bridge google routers/points). Assuming ONT acts as a modem and is wired to main google router, noticed that my speeds are no longer gigabit & it only gets to 250 mbps average when checked with lan at each point including the main. Not sure what is causing the speed to be this low. Any pointers that could help restore the speed close to gigabit or atleast 700mbps wired?

[PatrickP_Viking]

Hey @SammyUS .

That's great! Were you able to get the settings changes made per the instructions before disconnecting the Verizon router?

[SammyUS]

@PatrickP_Viking If you’re asking about the following settings then YES i did follow these steps. However, when I clicked RELEASE under DHCP, it quickly re-renders - the APPLY button is always greyed out through out the process before & after. So not sure if there is something here

1. Release the IP address on your Fios router. This step is important. Usually, if a person has trouble getting their own router to work with Fios, it is due to not releasing the IP address. To do this simply:
   1.  Click on the My Network icon at the top of the page
   2.  Click Network Connections from the menu on the left.
   3. Click Broadband Connection
   4. Click Settings
   5. Scroll down and click Release under DHCP Lease. Then apply changes. After they apply turn off your Fios router.

[SammyUS]

@PatrickP_Viking if you talking about RELEASE button under dhcp lease, then yes I clicked that button. however, the apply button was greyed out.. not sure if that was successful. What do you think

[PatrickP_Viking]

Hey @SammyUS .

That could be a cause but there could be other things in play:

• LAN tests done from a device are only going to show the speeds of that device and not the bandwidth of the network itself. The lower speeds could be due to a setting that needs to be changed on the device or router, device limitations, or something on the Verizon side. What speeds are you getting by doing a network test through the Home app? You can try tweaking some of the Advanced settings like turning on or off IPv6, WPA3, etc. to see if changing those affects anything and it should help narrow down if it is a network setting or device issue.
• From the Home app you can do a Device Speed Test that will show you the speed between the device and router. In the Home app, select Wifi, then Devices, select a device, then scroll to the bottom of the information. Tap the "Check device speed" button to see what is happening on the network side. If the speeds are slower that the LAN tests, it is something on the device side causing slower speeds with the LAN tests.
• The ONT could still be configured on the back end for Ethernet and coaxial and Verizon Support will have to disable it. Verizon does this sometimes since it doesn't affect performance as long as you use their router. Only Verizon can turn off the coaxial output if they've locked it in on the back end which would cause slower speeds.
• The ONT could be old and the Verizon router was boosting the bandwidth. This is something that is done regularly. You can look up the ONT model and check the specs and when it was produced. If it is old or outdated, you can request an upgraded ONT from Verizon.

These are the most likely causes but others could be in play. Let me know if any of the above solves the issue or uncovers something else. The first two should narrow it down significantly and possibly save a call to Verizon Support.

Let me know how it goes.

[SammyUS]

Hi @PatrickP_Viking the overall mesh  shows “great connection”. Google home speed test shows. 830mbps. When ran the device test for my phone it showed 450 mbps & when checked to my laptop which is on wifi shows 280 to 340mbps(my laptop is 10 to 20feet away from the closest wired point. We moved to new house last year and based on that ONT seems to be fairly new & they setup my ONT  to fios router using ethernet & said that coax is only active if i had a tv subscription which i DO NOT. I only had wifi service  from fios & coax was never active(always disabled) as per the rep’s response today.

Now, I haven’t tweaked any advanced settings of the google router. The current settings are as below:

NETWORK CONTROLS

- Use wifi protected access 3 — Inactive

- UPnP —- Active

- IPv6 —- Inactive

NETWORK CONFIG

- DNS Setting — Automatic

- WAN Connection —- DHCP is checked

- DHCP IP reservation —- ‘ You have no DHCP IP reservations‘

- Port Management —- ‘you have no port forwarding rules’

- Device Mode —- main router is NAT mode & points are Bridge mode.

Not sure how to debug this further to fix the issue with the speed.

[PatrickP_Viking]

Hey @SammyUS .

If the speed test in the Home app is showing the correct speed for your service and tests for the devices is lower, it is pointing to the devices being the cause. This could be due to the band they are connecting to, settings that need to be adjusted, or hardware limitations. 

What do the "Check device speed" tests show for those devices within the Home app?

[SammyUS]

hi @PatrickP_Viking - i have checked it for my phone as a device… the home app shows my phone is connected yo family room wifi point located in floor 1 & results are as below.

874 mbps Internet speed

434 mbps wifi point speed

567 mbps device speed

[PatrickP_Viking]

Hey @SammyUS .

Let me see if I can unpack the results:

• Internet speed - Seems fine
• Wifi point speed - I'm not sure exactly what this means. The points are tested via the mesh connection test but doesn't show Mbps.
• Device speed - If this is from the "Check device speed" then it is fine. Your network bandwidth is going to vary at any given time. All of the devices are sharing the same bandwidth from the ISP so if one needs more than another one then it will get more. These are managed by the router.

Bandwidth on any network, whether it is internal or an ISP's external, will vary constantly. Usually this is due to available resources vs. need determined by a priority hierarchy set by numerous factors. As the available vs. need changes, so will the speeds you can see. ISPs only advertise "up to" for that reason; the same is true on your personal network. There are some high end routers that allow you to change priority tables but they are not for less than experts since it is something that shouldn't really be messed with in most cases.

The main things you need to concentrate on IMO are these:

• Speed test from the Home app - This is a direct speed check to determine what bandwidth you are receiving from the ISP to the router.
• "Check device speed" tests - This is an internal network test to show the bandwidth from the router to the device and back. This will vary per the above explanation.
  • TIP: To see the difference in what your Wifi and wired speeds are for the same device, do the device speed test when connected wirelessly and again wired  (turn of Wifi for the wired test)
• The two above are going to show you the health of the internal network from the router to the devices. If tests are good and you are not having issues with streaming, internet access, etc. then the router is doing its job and just let it be. If you are having issues, those two tests above will help show whether it is a device side or network side issue to help with troubleshooting the cause. Best thing I was ever told during my IT years: "Always start at the beginning of the chain instead of the end." What this does is help you trace it from the point of origin (i.e. the device) to the end (i.e. the router). Starting from the end could mean missing multiple issues at multiple points and a lot of wasted time.

As far as running a speed test from a device, I'd recommend to take it with a grain of salt and ONLY as a data point to compare with other data points. Those types of tests are testing the speed from the device to a specific website/IP. These speeds will vary, sometimes widely, between testing runs, devices, and other speed test sites. They are testing the speed from the device through your network, out to the ISP, several servers to the host site and any gear contained in any of the networks in between. So at any given time you are sharing everything with everyone else doing the same. There are too many unknowns and inaccessible factors involved to be a true indicator of your personal network's performance. I tend to use those types of tests to compare to various internal network tests to see if speed issues could be on the ISP side.

My advice is not to drive yourself crazy with what speeds you are constantly getting with devices or the network in general. Tests are going to vary all the time. If you look at the devices connected list you'll see it changes every refresh depending on what device needs what at that time. If everything is functioning properly, then let it be. If you are having issues with performance due to lack of bandwidth, then start troubleshooting from the device out. 

Let me if you are having any issues.

[AbigailF]

Hey folks, 

@PatrickP_Viking, appreciate your helpful response. 
@SammyUS, chiming in to ensure everything is good here. Were you able to see @PatrickP_Viking's response?

Best,
Abi

[AbigailF]

Hello SammyUS,

Checking back in should you still have some questions here. Let us know by replying to this thread. 

Regards, 
Abi

[AbigailF]

Hi everyone,

We haven't heard from you in a while so we'll be locking this thread if there is no update within 24 hours. If you have any new issues, updates or just a discussion topic, feel free to start a new thread in the Community.

Cheers, 
Abi