Google Nest access point "weak connection"

[Kyle_AMA]

Three months ago I bought a Nest WIFI router and access point.  The router has been great, but the access point has been horrible.  I can never get about a "weak connection".  I have tried all the troubleshooting tips and spent countless hours with the Google Techs who don't seem to know what to do.  I can place the access point right next to the router, run a mesh test and I have a "weak connection".  Distance doesn't change anything.  Google sent me a replacement access point and it also sets up with a "weak connection".  I have it places literally 3 feet from the main Google router.  Does anyone have any ideas for me?  I love Google products, but three months in and I am feeling a bit like I have bought a lemon.  

[MichaelP]

Hello @Kyle_AMA 

This kind of thing can be really challenging to diagnose. But, the one thought I have is to ask whether you have any wireless speakers in use? In particular, any wireless surround sound system – even a sound bar with a wireless subwoofer. Those may be using the same RF spectrum as the Nest WiFi 5GHz channel, and that can cause problems. Similarly, something like a wireless gaming headset, or things like the equipment used by some wireless internet service providers. Basically, this looks like interference to me, so I'd be looking for other wireless devices.

[Kyle_AMA]

Thank you for the reply.  I appreciate you taking time to help me.  We don't have any wireless speakers.  We do have Google Nest minis throughout the house, and I have cameras outdoor and indoor.  But none of those run over Bluetooth.  I do have a Bluetooth headset that I use once a week or so when I'm working from home.  We do have a microwave :-).  The ethernet cables run in the Attic along with a lot of electrical wiring, they are not separated from one another.   That's all I can really think of.  What are your thoughts?

[MichaelP]

I'm not worried about the Nest minis – those are just WiFi clients. The cameras shouldn't be a problem either (assuming they are also WiFi clients and not using their own wireless technology). Bluetooth runs in the 2.4GHz band, so I'm not worried about that, either (the issue you're seeing is in the 5GHz band). The microwave oven also really only causes problems in the 2.4GHz band (and only when it's running). I don't think your Ethernet cables are an issue, since it sounds like you're using a Nest WiFi Point unit as the secondary access point, and that doesn't support Ethernet.

Do you have any other WiFi networks in operation? Like, for example, a combination modem+router from your internet service provider that might have WiFi enabled? That's less likely to be the cause, but if something like that was really close to either the primary Nest WiFi Router unit or the secondary Nest WiFi Point unit, it could conceivably cause problems.

Can you describe in more detail where the Nest WiFi Router and Point units are placed? For optimal operation, you want the Router unit placed as close to the center of your home as possible with the Point unit one or two rooms away (assuming hollow wall construction – if you have brick, concrete, or plaster walls, the Point will need to be closer). Also, both units should be out in the open (not inside cabinets or under furniture, for example), and placed relatively high if possible (not on the floor).

[Kyle_AMA]

Thank you again for all the help.  No other networks or routers.  We run fiber and I have no modem, the internet company says I can run it straight to the router.  My wired speeds are very high 850 MBPS.  My router is placed in the center of our home up high on a shelf and my access point is in the same room...no walls...direct line of sight and no matter whether 5 feet, 10 feet, 25 feet...it says weak connection.  That is what baffles me, I'm not even through a wall.  One story house.  I can stand at the access point and see the router with nothing in between.

[MichaelP]

That is puzzling. What kind of performance do clients get when they are connected to the Nest WiFi Router unit? If you open the Google Home app, go into the list of WiFi devices, and pick one that is currently connected to the Nest WiFi Router via a 5GHz connection and run a speed test (bottom of the "info" tab), it should be a few hundred megabits per second for something like a recent phone or laptop (though, to be honest, some laptops include relatively anemic WiFi implementations and may be more limited). What I'm trying to get at here is to determine whether there is general 5GHz interference (which would impact both units), or something specific to the Point.

Can I ask whether you really need the Nest WiFi Point unit at all? The Nest WiFi Router unit has a pretty good WiFi implementation. You may find it covers your home just fine without the Nest WiFi unit being there at all.

[Kyle_AMA]

So, I ran the mini that is closest to the main router and it shows 10.9 Mbps.    That sounds slow based on your previous message?  I ran on a few others and the results are similar.  Our house is one story and 3000 square feet, would just the router work?

[MichaelP]

I just tested a Nest Mini I have and got a speed of 158Mbps to a Google WiFi unit on the other side of a wall. So, yeah – I think 10.9Mbps is lower than I would expect, unless it's quite far away from the Nest WiFi Router or there are significant obstructions in the way (e.g., metal objects like a refrigerator, solid walls made from concrete, brick, or plaster, etc.). So, at this point, I am more suspicious of the radio in your Nest WiFi Router unit than the Nest WiFi Point unit (especially since that's been replaced once already without a change). Can you try running device speed tests to a few other things connected to the Nest WiFi Router just to get some more data points? Recent phones, tablets, laptops, etc.?

[Kyle_AMA]

I ran to my phone (Samsung Galaxy S21) showing 205 MBPS, ran to Samsung Galaxy Tab 3 46 MBPS, a few more minis at 20-30 MBPS.  It seems as if some devices are trying to connect to the access point that is further away than the main router.  

[MichaelP]

205Mbps is reasonable, depending on the distance (for comparison, my iPhone 13 gets 343Mbps in the same room as an AC1200 2x2 Google WiFi unit). I think 46Mbps is definitely a little low. Nest minis don't have (or need) particularly strong WiFi, but I got much faster ratings from mine when I tested it. All in all, these feel low to me, and could confirm the issue has more to do with your Nest WiFi Router unit.

As for your second point about which access points each client connects to, that is up to the client. Google/Nest WiFi do provide clients with extra information in the form of 802.11k and 802.11v messages, but many clients don't support these specifications. Apple devices do, and they seem to hand off within a minute or so of moving to another part of the house. But, only some Android and some Windows devices support those, and I don't think any fixed devices (like Nest Mini speakers, for example) do. Those devices can end up connecting to the primary (Nest WiFi Router) and getting "stuck" to it, or they can end up connecting to the first access point they see (more likely for mobile devices like phones and tablets) and then "sticking" with that as long as it continues to work even when a more optimal choice is available. For benchmarking, you want to use the Google Home app to verify exactly which access point the device is currently connected to, and if it's the wrong one, disable and re-enable the WiFi on that device to get it to "switch".

[Jeff]

Hi, Kyle_AMA.

It's been a little bit since MichaelP's last response here, but I wanted to check in to see if you still had any additional questions on this. If you need anything more, just let us know.

Thanks.

[Kyle_AMA]

Hi Jeff - thanks for the note.  I just been busy with work.  I continue to feel frustrated by my purchase of the Google Wifi Router and access point.  Nothing has changed and I continue to experience very slow speeds from my access point.  MichaelP's final comment was that he felt that the problem would lie with the Nest WIFI router unit.  I agree...the truth is when I was troubleshooting the access point I spent literally hours, days, working with techs and I just simply don't have days, hours to work with them again.  Is there anyway I can simply return the entire unit to Google (it is still under warranty) and move on with my life.  Or, do I have to submit to hours and days of troubleshooting steps?  Thanks for the help.  If ya'll have other ideas that I can try with the router unit I am willing.  

[Dkdmoore]

Just retun both units to where you purchased (or Google if over 30 days) abs day the main unit will not power on

[Jeff]

Hi, Kyle_AMA.

Sorry for the delayed response here, but I wanted to check back in to see if you tried reaching out to support to find out if they could help here. If you haven't tried with them, here's how to reach them directly: https://bit.ly/3o1aRK5.

If there's any issues with your hardware, they can diagnose it during a live chat or phone call. Let me know if you have any issues reaching them.

Thanks.

[Jeff]

Hey, Kyle_AMA.

I'm checking once more to see if you were able to get in contact with support and to see if you were able to get this resolved.

Thanks.

[Kyle_AMA]

Hi Jeff, thanks for checking on this.  I tried and spent a few more hours on it with tech support.  To be honest the tech support is so bad that I went and bought a Netgear router and access point.  Not a single problem anymore.  Which seems to confirm that it was Google on this one.  So, I have 5 month old Router and Access point and it's in the box.  Not sure what to do with it, just a waste of money at this point and Google will not refund my money.   I love Google products, but this was a nightmare.

[Jeff]

I understand, Kyle_AMA. Hopefully the new setup proves to be trouble free. If you ever do choose to pick up troubleshooting again on the Nest setup, feel free to start up a new thread and we'll be happy to help. For now, I'll go ahead and close this thread as you've found a new solution.

Thanks.