Thread network not present when using Google Nest Hub Max

[CplChef]

Hi, when connecting Matter devices with Google Home (my brand new Google Nest Hub Max who should in theory act as a Thread Border Router), the Matter devices get detected and the process to add them and connects the device starts.

When I try to add the devices, it goes thru the process of detecting the correct device, it create the Matter identity, then connect, then verify the connection and at the end I get "Can't connect to the Thread Network NEST-PAN-****" message.

I've already tried to factory reset the device and the Google Nest hub Max many times. I've also uninstalled Google Home on my mobile phone. I've tried with 2 different mobile phones. Etc. I've also passe many hours chatting with Google Nest support. No success so far.

The interesting thing is I've installed the Nanoleaf App and in the setting it indicates NO THREAD NETWORK FOUND. How can I verify that the Thread Border Router on the Google Nest Hub Max is working corectly? Should I replace it? I see other users have reported this same problem in the last few weeks.

[Muddi]

Hello CplChef,

Thanks for sharing details about the issue here. I know how challenging it is when you're having issues connecting your Matter-enabled device to your Google Nest Hub Max. To confirm, have you set up your Matter-enabled device in the manufacturer's app? What is the current firmware version of your Nest Hub Max? What is the make and model of your phone/tablet?

Looking forward to your response.

Cheers,

Muddi

[CplChef]

Hi, this is a Matter device; therefore, it doesn't need a manufacturer app. In fact, this device is not even listed an any of the Aqara app because it is a Matter device.

The Nest Hub Max is brand new:

- Version Fuchsia: 12.20230611.1.67

- Software version: 53.110.0.549404370

I've tried to connect with Google Home on 2 mobile devices: Samsung S23 and Samsund S8. Same result.

I'm have the lastest version of Google Home.

[Muddi]

Hi CplChef,

Thanks for the information. What specific Matter-enabled device do you have? If you're trying to connect an Aqara device, you will need an Aqara hub that will be able to support Matter and connect with other third-party Matter devices. You can find more information on Aqara's website: Aqara Releases Details around its First Matter-compatible Devices

Also, setting up your Matter-enabled device in the manufacturer’s app (if there is one available) is needed to share device access with the Google Home app.

Here's another link that will be helpful to you: Manage Matter-enabled devices in the Google Home app

Cheers,

Muddi

[CplChef]

Hi, again this is a Matter device and therefore it doesn't need a manufacturer app. Matter devices should be able to connect to a Thread border router. I have a Google Nest Hub Max and it is supposed to be a Thread border router. 

[MarkP58]

I could be wrong but I think what he is saying is the matter support is via the Aqara Matter enabled Hub and so using the Aqara App to manage the devices settings including matter mode/support. Similarly when setting up my Aqara devices for Apple you can either use HomeKit to scan in QR code or Enable HK via Aqara App?  Just a thought..

[CplChef]

Hi, no this is incorrect since Matter devices do not need Aqara app nor Aqara hub. In my topology, I have a Google Nest Hub Max that is a Thread Border Router. So it should be sufficient.

[Muddi]

Hey MarkP58,

Exactly! I appreciate your help.

Cheers.

Muddi

[CplChef]

Hi, no this is incorrect since Matter devices do not need Aqara app nor Aqara hub. In my topology, I have a Google Nest Hub Max that is a Thread Border Router. So it should be sufficient.

[JS740]

The link for the Aqara Hub M2 is old, I have 2 of these and they are not a Matter Hub they are just Matter enabled... Aqara is releasing Matter Hub in early 2024.  The Aqara Door and Window Sensor P2's do not connect to the Aqara Hub M2, they require the Nest Hub Max's (I have 2) in my network for a connection. 

[BeholdersEye]

I'm also having issues with thread on Max hub... I have already connected several thread devices and was working... Now all the thread devices are showing our OFFLINE!!! How is that possible and how do I reconnect the thread devices??? 

[Muddi]

Hey BeholdersEye,

Sorry to hear that. To confirm, did you add your Matter-enabled device to the manufacturer’s app? If so, what app is it (e.g. Google Home, Amazon Alexa, etc.)? What is the make and model of your mobile device?

Cheers,

Muddi

[CplChef]

Hi, no this is incorrect since Matter devices do not need Aqara app nor Aqara hub.  A Google Nest Hub Max that is a Thread Border Router. So it should be sufficient.

[Alanstapelberg]

Muddi, I think you need to learn more about how Matter works... The WHOLE point of the matter protocol is that it works without needing the manufacturer app. As long as the device is Matter certified it should connect with the Google Home Hub and work with the Google Home App. 

I too am having issues with my Hub Max. It worked perfectly initially and then I had to reset on things so I tried factory resetting my Hub and also SmartThings Hub. Now no matter what I do, I can not get smarthings to connect to my device, as it keeps asking for the Network Key for the thread network that the Google Home Hub initiated. Specifically the 32 Character network key.

Where do I find this?

[BeholdersEye]

I have mujoy matter over thread light bulb, and onvis matter over thread smart plug... Both are plugged in and reading as off line on Google Home app...

But can control in aidot app and onvis has no app that I can find... 

[Muddi]

Hello BeholdersEye,

To confirm, have you been able to control your devices using voice commands? If not, I would suggest removing and re-adding your devices through the Google Home app. This can help refresh the connection between your devices and the app and hopefully resolve any issues you may be experiencing.

Keep us posted.

Cheers,

Muddi

[Skersh]

I've having this issue as well trying to connect an Eve Energy Matter/Thread smart plug to my Nest Hub Max.

Steps to reproduce:

1. plug in Eve Energy smart plug into the wall
2. Using Google Home app add a new device using the "New Device" link, not "Works with Google"
3. Select Eve smart plug from the list of found devices
4. Scan the Matter QR Code on the Eve device
5. Allow Google Home to establish Matter Credentials
6. The connection fails between Nest Hub Max and Eve plug

Google lists the Nest Hub Max as a Thread Border Router on this support page , and Eve documents Nest Hub Max as a compatible Thread Border Router as well here. Eve does not have an Android app or a "3rd party hub". As I understand it, and as @CplChef  mentioned a few times before, the Nest Hub Max should be enough. 

Nest Hub Max firmware: 14.20230831.4.67

---

Edit: I came back a few hours later and tried again to pair my devices. This time I had no issues pairing my thread enabled plugs with my Nest Hub Max. 

[CplChef]

I'm happy you were able to make it workon your side. It still doesn't work for me and I have the same firmware. I'm on this issue for 2 months now without any proper support for Google Nest and Aqara...

[Muddi]

Hey CplChef,

To confirm, do you currently own an Aqara Hub? Please note that while some matter-enabled devices have their own manufacturer's apps, others don't. Aqara has a native app, so it's necessary to first set up the device on their app in order to manage device settings, including matter mode/support. If you need more information, you can check out this link from the Aqara website, which provides details about their first Matter-compatible devices.

Cheers,

Muddi

[CplChef]

Hi, no and it is not required since this is a Matter device. It doesn't need a manufacturer app nor hub. It's supposes go connect directly to Google Nest Hub Max. The 'Aqara Door and Windows Sensor P2' is a Matter device and is not listed in the Aqara app. Even Aqara confirmed all it needs is the Google Nest Hub Max (that is acting as a Thread Border Router).

[Muddi]

Hi CplChef,

Understood! I'll go ahead and escalate this to our higher tier of support. Please fill out this form with all the needed information then let me know once done.

Cheers,

Muddi

[CplChef]

Done. I've completed the form and submited it.

[Muddi]

Hey CplChef,

Thanks — we got your form and have sent it over to our team for review. Please check your inbox from time to time as someone will be reaching out to you. 
 

@Skersh: I appreciate all your efforts. Please fill out this form with all the needed information. I’ll keep an eye out for your response specifically, so please let me know once you’ve filled it out. 

Cheers,

Muddi

[figadore]

If there has been any progress, can you post it here?

[Sphazz]

I am having this same issue.

I have four Matter over Thread devices that use a Google Nest Hub Gen 2 as their border router. One Mujoy light bulb, two Onvis smart plugs and one Aqara door sensor. All four have functioned perfectly for over a month with no issue, none required a separate app to function and used Google Home as their original eco-system. I do have an Aqara Matter hub, but it is only Zigbee, not thread and was not used for the Aqara Door and Windows Sensor P2, it was paired directly with Google Home. I have IPv6 enabled on my router and no WiFi related issues that I can speak of. I also use my Google Nest Hub Gen 2 as Thread border for Home Assistant, which I host locally and have linked all devices to by pairing via Google Home. 

On 12/4/2023 my thread devices became unavailable on my instance of Home Assistant, but were still functioning in the Google Home app. When I checked my Nest Hub 2 in Home Assistant it couldn't detect a thread border router, something it had never had an issue with before. If I used the Google Home app to check my "Linked Matter apps & services" it would load for an extended period of time and them give me an error in a toast that "Something went wrong" and display zero linked apps, even though there was one.

I tried rebooting all devices and services with no results. On 12/6/2023 I tried pairing a new Onvis smart plug and it failed citing network connectivity issues, so I decided to fully reset my Google Nest Hub Gen 2 to see if that rectify the problem, but it instead became worse and now no devices can connect with all previous device offline. I reset all of my Matter over Thread devices and tried a new Onvis smart plug which had previously never been paired but no devices will connect to my Nest Hub 2's thread network and I receive an error that the device "Can't connect to thread network NEST-PAN-XXXX Check that your device can work with this network type and try again."

Since everything worked previously, I know that the devices are fully compatibly with my Nest Hub Gen 2. I've received other errors, such as "Can't reach device. Make sure your phone is connected to Wi-Fi," which it most certainly is, although I have had this issue before and normally can just retry a few times and it will eventually pair.

My Fuchsia Version is 12.20230611.1.67, software version 53.110.0.54.9404370

I have a suspicious that on 12/4/2023 my device received the latest update and that is the cause to this problem. I am going to follow the advice given to others and submit a ticket, but this issue does not seem to be isolated and probably needs to be elevated.

[JS740]

I'm also having issues with both Nanoleaf essentials lights (only Nanoleaf products I have, so require connection through Nest Hub Max) as well as 2 of 3 of my Aqara door and window sensors P2's. I've added a Google Script automation that when a door opens my Nest Hub Max says which door was just opened. Worked great for about 2 months but just stopped working a couple weeks ago on 2 of the sensors and the Google Home App doesn't show the change in open/closed status although they still show online in the Google home app.

Nanoleaf essentials lights seemed to work for 2 or 3 days being able to be voice controlled, but now can only use them through the Nanoleaf app. Did a lot of trouble shooting early on with these but was hoping for an update that would fix it as there seems to be lots of issues with matter at the moment.

I do plan on getting Aqara's matter enabled hub when it comes out as I'm looking to have the sensors work as my alarm system once Nest Secure turns into a paper weight, and want to be able to rely on the product to have peace of mind when using it as an alarm system.

Not sure if updates are different for different countries but I am in Canada and having the same issues as others in this feed.

Did not put a ticket in yet, as it's not a "my network" problem, it's a wide spread problem! 

[Sphazz]

---

@JS740 wrote:

I do plan on getting Aqara's matter enabled hub

---

I assume you mean a Matter over Thread Hub, because I own Aqara's M2 Hub with Zigbee 3.0 and it's Matter enabled, but not Thread enabled. There is a possibility that Aqara could add Thread support down the road to their M2 because other manufacturers have done it, but they're probably going to release their long awaited and much postponed new hub next year which has out-of-the-box Thread support. Samsung also has their Smart Hub which is Matter over Thread enabled, I've seen $1 deals on it if you check the SamsungUS twitter account, but so far haven't been able to snag it. For a buck, I'll take a chance if I can then pair it with HomeAssistant and Google Home.

That aside, it's positively INSANE how stable the Aqara M2 Hub is and just how terrible Google's Nest Hubs are. I've had two Matter over Thread outlets drop connect this week, one automatically reconnected and the other had to had unplug and plug back in to connect back to my Nest Hub 2. I also added a new device and it killed my entire Thread network for an hour. Meanwhile, I've got a HomeAssistant SkyConnect in my server rack which is practically a faraday cage and my Aqara Hub M2 both just hanging out, stable as can be, doing all sorts of crazy automatics with zero dropped connections.

Then there's my Nest Hub 2 randomly loses all sense of self and drops devices more often than Google axes enjoyed features from their product list. As far as automations go, I've got a similar one with my Aqara P2 Door and Window sensor on my Front and Back doors, except it only runs if I'm not home and sends me an alert that my doors have opened. The problem is, I literally have no way of knowing that my Nest Hub 2 has dropped my sensors unless I check them, so my automations could fail without my knowing and I'm, just SOL. I guess I could maybe write up an automation to check if my sensors are online, or rely on Home Assistant, but it's such a pain that nothing works right on Google's end.

As far as a ticket goes, I put in a ticket TWO WEEKS ago and haven't received a response. I even responded below and mentioned the "Community Specialist" and haven't heard anything back. My suggestion would be to reset your Nest Hub Max and pair all your devices again. If you can't pair them again, your Thread network might be down, mine "fixed" itself after three days because who knows. It's been better, but still unstable.

[NetManinTN]

I also had an Eve Energy go offline in the last few days.  I am trying to add that back and also a Aqara P2 sensor and both are failing. I can add them in HomeKit with no issues.

[Morlock]

This is happening to me too. Nest hub (2nd gen) trying to use aquara p2 sensor. It stopped working a few days ago, tried resetting everything and it says there is no border router? It makes no sense.

[Sphazz]

Wanted to post an update on my issue since others are responding.

After a reset of my Nest Hub Gen 2 and two days, the border router became available again and I was able to reconnect all of my Thread enabled devices. I found it strange that "waiting" was the fix for a local network issue, but eventually it just came back online and I was able to pair my devices. But unfortunately, there's now two new issues.

The first is I had to restart my access point recently and when that happened, even though my Nest Gen 2 was able to reconnect to WiFi almost immediately, the Thread border router on the device stayed down for nearly an hour leaving my devices unavailable. Sometimes I just need to restart my APs or reboot after making some settings changes and having all my Thread devices go offline for an unknown period of time isn't acceptable.

The second is an ongoing problem, devices keep disconnecting and reconnecting. As I mentioned previously, I run Home Assistant and in the logs my Matter over Thread devices keep disconnecting and reconnecting timing out while waiting for an mDNS resolution, sometimes as much as 30 times a minute. Unlike Google Home, I can actually check logs and debug the Thread network and devices are constantly timing out and having to resubscribe to the Thread networking. I cannot isolate this to Google Home or Home Assistant/python-matter-server, but previous to the 12.20230611.1.67 update on my Nest Hub Gen 2 I never had this issue. I have also noticed the devices going offline in Google Home, so while the issue is more easily observable in Home Assistant, it's happening in Google Home as well but is hard to notice unless I try to use my device right as it becomes unavailable.

I'm also still waiting for a response from the contact form I submitted per the link posted by @Muddi.

[Morlock]

weird thing for me - i just tried adding my aquara P2 sensor and it worked? who knows for how long but still. i have no idea whats going on, and frankly im thinking about buying a used ipad and switching to homekit for some of my devices.

[Sphazz]

Sounds like what happened to me, the Thread border router randomly fixed itself. One thing worth noting, I have noticed that using different devices to add Matter supported devices to Google Home yield better results. My Z Fold 4 has more issues with adding devices than my S8 Ultra tablet, but that requires a border router to be present, which is what this topic is covering.

Also, ever since the Thread border router on my Nest Hub Gen 2 has "fixed" itself, every Matter over Thread device gets stuck at "Adding to Google Home." I've found that if I just wait a minute or so, I can exit the setup and the device was been added. You can also check on a second device with the Google Home app to confirm it has been added before exiting the "Adding to Google Home" screen.

One step forward two steps back?

Since my last post, I had two Onvis Matter over Thread outlets drop. One fixed itself, the other requires me to move my couch (ugh) and manually unplug and plug the outlet back in to get it to reappear in Google Home. I've also seen some, but not as many, "Device has become unavailable" in Home Assistant (which uses my Nest Hub Gen 2 as a Thread border router). Lastly, I did add another Aqara P2 Sensor and had the "Adding to Google Home" issue, which promptly killed my entire Thread network for an hour, which is the worst example of Thread's ability to "self heal," which it knocked itself offline in the process of "healing." Is it really "healing" when your border router can't hold a connection in the first place?

Lastly, I had previous started a Reddit thread in hopes of getting some actual help. I received a response from @figadore and outlined my crackpot theory that WiFi instability is to blame. Anyone, ESPECIALLY YOU GOOGLE, ANYTIME NOW, IF YOU FEEL LIKE, can read more here. TL;DR, The WiFi network my Nest Hub Gen 2 was on had some interference issues. I had no issues before my Thread border router died even with the interference and still have issues after resolving the WiFi problems, but it's my leading suspicion outside of "the latest Nest update is broken, more so than just bricking people's Google Home and Google Home Mini."